To understand more of this subject so vast and fascinating, we spoke with Marco Pesatori, one of the most renowned Italian astrologers. A man of great culture, which goes far beyond the sole astrology, distinguished by his gentle but still direct manners and his “ars oratoria” made of images that speak directly to the soul. Gifted by a natural magnetism which is hard to resist, in his astrological consultations Pesatori takes you by hand on a journey into your innermost being. He describe himself as a storyteller – definition that fit him well now more than ever, having published the novel “Il trigono del sole”, published by Feltrinelli. He’s the author of the astrological column both of “Vogue” and “D di Repubblica”; he collaborates with Rai and worked for years for “Alpha Beta”, the historic literary magazine.
We asked about his point of view on magic and astrology, the human being and the key to be happier, that he shared with his characteristic candor and transparency.
Astrology is more science or magic?
Astrology is an art. It is an interpretative art. Unlike science that works on numbers and quantities – as the numbers are called into question by science itself – astrology is also a science, but a science of man, of the human. It’s a “science of quality”, which works with symbols: it’s a science of symbolic wealth. But it’s an art because these symbols are to be interpreted.
What’s your relationship with magic?
If by magic we mean that garbage with which the West tries to find consolation in moments of despair, there’s no relationship. Zero.
Instead if we mean that “mag”, that something inexpressible that’s very close to poetry, which we’re used to call “magic”, the question is very different. This link was in fact the core of the entire Renaissance thought (Marsilio Ficino, Raimondo Lullo, Giordano Bruno, Pico Della Mirandola … all Renaissance philosophers are philosophers of the magic). It’s the thought that urges us to achieve full awareness that one is all, and all is one, and that all things are interconnected with each other in a continuum that only the man rational mind thinks to being able to split.
What should be expected from astrology to draw maximum benefit?
Given that today in Italy saying “astrologer” is like saying “bitch”, because Italy is a culturally backward country. This cultural backwardness and the appalling ignorance of our intellectuals and philosophers, mean that astrology is confined in the “servants room” of all the sciences.
The astrological work is nothing but the same deep investigative work that should do psychoanalysis. The astrological work is a work of analysis – ana-luo, which in greek means “untie the knots”. This is the work of astrology.
I remember having heard you say that “a serious astrologer doesn’t makes predictions about the future”. How to recognize a good astrologer?
A good astrologer can be recognized by two factors: first, he/she doesn’t cost more than € 100. Second, indeed, by the fact that a good astrologer doesn’t make forecasts.
Nowadays many people are frightened by uncertainty and seek concrete answers. Giving very specific answers about the future is matter of astrology?
In daily and weekly horoscopes, sometimes you perceive a little predictive air; but considering that despite having a good value – especially the daily ones that are based on the moon – in Italy, for example, there are 6 million pisces. So generic horoscopes will never have a predictive value. In studio work, the forecast (from “pre-vision”, that is “see first”) must not be taken as a verdict, but instead as the start of a work of “self awareness”. It’s a work of analysis, which can only be made starting from the conditions that the person is experiencing. The astrological work is above all a work on awareness: a job of conscience amplification.
About this: everybody has the ability to “feel” – that they call it “sixth sense”, intuition or premonition … How important is for a good astrologer being a little “magic”? Meaning to have the ability to “feel” something about the person in front of you, that goes beyond calculations, quadrature, planets positions …
Given that I’ve never known magic astrologers in Italy, except for Morpurgo, Sicuteri and Bezza (three people who seriously and validly dealt with astrology). Currently in Italy there are none. Because there isn’t a serious and rigorous training school about this subject. I had a thousand students in 40 years, but I gave the blue sticker just to a few. Astrology is a serious matter. Instead we see some figures that can’t even take care of a landing but “work” as astrologers instead. There should be a degree obligation, then a path of deep analysis of the psyche, then a cultural endorsement that lacks today. So 99 out of 100 astrologers are just infinite ignorance, equal to their conceit and arrogance.
Being a so-called “magic” astrologer, intuitive and capable of an analysis that goes beyond the rational reflection, is an arrival point. The work with the consultant is a great job of cleaning up the self. And when the self is well cleaned, that’s when the valid intuition emerges, and events can happen that Jung would have called as synchronic and denoting a big “knack” for the depths.
You’re a little magic, right?
Well no, no.. (laughs). It begins to be a little magic when there is no ego. So I’m magic, when my ego is not there.
Why do people turn to an astrologer? What they look for?
Given that I am an out of the category “astrologers”, but I have a counseling service on the web, the most frequent questions are about love and personality.
Love at 40%: the self and personality to 30%; work to 15% and others (relatives, etc.) another 15%.
In fact all sorts of questions, especially about love dramas, implies a single desire, namely: self-knowledge. They’re seeking to restore the power to be themselves. The request to find a way for the conquest of happiness, which involves the conquest of autonomy and, indeed, of one’s self.
Love is no longer a pain when the person is centered, when he knows who he is. So the work of astrology is to bring the person to itself so as to be more centered.
Do we have the capacity and freedom, as individuals, to change what is “written” in our sky at the moment of our birth?
The astrological work is just that. It’s the awareness of those points in our birth chart, that is the ego, which are suffering, tiring, which signal a wound. In front of a wounded soul, the person has two paths: in the first, suffering turns into negative energy – aggressive toward himself and that generates devaluation; the other way is converse with this wound in the soul, understand it. Hegel said “linger at the negative, look it into the eyes, and stay close to him softly”: This being next to our negativity and analyzing it (“ana-luo”, to dissolve), it’s the work of astrology. And this work will change the DNA. For someone evolved, oppositions and quadratures, even in transit, become beautiful aspects.
The more consciousness there is, the less we suffer the stars, as we become the stars.
What’s your favorite word of Italian language:
“Ammore”, with two “m”.
What’s the magic gesture of our everyday life?
The smile (laughs).
by Cinzia Pallaoro